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|MacGyver Online Forums > Episode Discussions > 4.13 - Save + The + Dam + World|
|Posted by: MacGyverOnline 10 July 2019 - 01:06 AM|
4-13 Save + The + Dam + World
Airdate: May 8, 2020
Story: Terry Matalas
Teleplay: Cindy Appel
Director: Carlos Bernard
Jeri Ryan (Gwendolyn Hayes)
Zach McGowan (Roman)
Amber Skye Noyes (Scarlett)
Scottie Thompson (Ellen MacGyver)
Tobin Bell (Leland)
Mary Elizabeth Kirkpatrick (Ella)
Drey Wigfall (Agent #1)
Annie Cook (Senator Burnett)
Satya Polisetti (Aide)
With Mac and Riley undercover with Codex, hoping to stop the organization from within, their mission is interrupted when Russ, Desi and the Phoenix team move to prevent Codex from detonating a weapon of mass destruction, with Mac and Riley caught in the crosshairs. Also, the team discovers Russ’ real reason for purchasing the Phoenix Foundation.
|Posted by: Jephthah 6 May 2020 - 02:42 PM|
|Saw the "Sneak Peak 1" on MacGyver's YouTube Channel (or "Sneak Peak 2" on Spoiler TVs YouTube channel) and if that is really how the episode plays out, I cannot tell you how disgusted I am with the direction the writers took. I was so looking forward to Friday night and now I don't even care if there is a Season 5. It was just wrong! More to say after the episode airs.|
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 6 May 2020 - 03:14 PM|
not my favorite storyline either. also, I think it would have worked better if maybe the story was told to Jack; considering he used to tease Mac for weeks about it in the Army. it feels more like an unnecessary inside joke.
|Posted by: Krug 7 May 2020 - 12:19 PM|
Yeah...but this is one of those things where you can kind of choose your own narrative since this doesn't appear to have been spoken into the narrative. I look at it as someone getting too cute for their own good. Inside joke is a good call.
MacGyver's a Scottish name, and so is Angus. Can absolutely picture a young Oversight choosing that name based on some Scottish legend he knows or something obscure.
That's what I'm going with anyway.
That's nothing to not want a Season 5 over though...lol. Still none-too-chuffed on the mom stuff apparently all being true. But we'll see come Friday.
|Posted by: Guest 7 May 2020 - 02:01 PM|
The name is one thing, but what really set me off is the mom thing being "apparently" true. If true, how in the world did his parents get together in marriage with such drastic ideologies in the first place?
|Posted by: Shy175223 8 May 2020 - 04:19 PM|
Well If Angus is Scottish name and so is MacGyver , I thought that he would be names after an ancestor from one of his parents' side instead of from a steakhouse billboard.
|Posted by: Shy175223 8 May 2020 - 05:49 PM|
| Well that was a good episode for season finale IF that's want it was. First of all, according to the promos for Mac and Riley are supposedly getting closer on this episode but that doesn't which happen, thank goodness,. however with Desi and Mac situation it appears that relationship is not over yet. I hope the writers are thinking TWICE about having a triangle.
I was kind of sad to see Aunt Gwen go just as she realizes that how strong her feelings for Mac are. I'm hoping that did she survive the bombing somehow. It would nice to see Mac have some sort connection to his family other than nothing.
Well we did find out there was a reason Russ went after Codex and that was revenge. He bought the Phoenix so he could use them get his revenge. It was tacky the way he went about it but understandable since Codex had hid colleagues killed.
As for the Desi/Mac relationship, I really felt for Desi because it does seem that Mac is pushing her away just as he had broken down her walls it seems. As much as I do feel that there are feeling there, I still don't think they are compatible together just because they are very different .
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 8 May 2020 - 05:57 PM|
I really, really don't want a love triangle next season. They're secret agents, not high-schoolers. I won't mind if there's less relationship drama next season...
Sadly, the writing for Desi is atrocious this season. I really don't know why they bothered to make her a regular. She changed from badass agent to whiny and bitchy girlfriend who doesn't trust her boyfriend at all. It's a bit difficult to still like her this season. Maybe because she never got a background story episode; she's just as much a blank page as Leanna was. Pity. To be honest, I don't know if and how they can redeem her.
I really like Levy and she has great chemistry with Lucas. Sadly, there's no chemistry between their characters (not sure if that's intentional) and I don't see why they'd still be together after the last few episodes...
Also, Riley risked her life and career by following Mac to Codex and doesn't even get "rewarded" by getting Mac as a prize
|Posted by: Shy175223 8 May 2020 - 07:03 PM|
Well at least a pat on the back will suffice.
|Posted by: Krug 8 May 2020 - 07:41 PM|
That's kind of what I was getting at. The pan over to the billboard being tongue-in-cheek.
After all, Ellen does says "we" when talking about not having decided on a name yet.
I'm going with my interpretation as canon. The beauty of fiction.
Ellen: "Jim, I found some inspiration for a name. How about 'Angus?'"
Jim: "Perfect. Did you know Angus Lennie played "Ives" in my favorite movie, The Great Escape? Also, I think I had a great-great uncle on my dad's side with that name."
|Posted by: Krug 8 May 2020 - 08:38 PM|
| Anywho, I'm busy tomorrow so my re-watch commences...now!
-"We Didn't Start The Fire" is a very appropriate song to underlie a File 47 discussion scene.
-Still don't like the narrative of Ellen being behind the sinister side of File 47, although it is hinted at being theoretical and it being a problem "in the hands of the government." Wish they had gone with (and we'll see this at the end of the episode with Mac using his mother's research in his presentation to the Senate committee) the story that Ellen posited societal changes needed to combat climate change, and Gwen (or an elderly fellow soon-to-be introduced) usurping that following her death and bastardizing it to what is presented here.
-I thought Mac was supposed to be an ugly baby? This little actor was cute!
-This Roman guy is everywhere!
-Codex sprung up in the wake of The Black Plague as part of the Renaissance...wonder what springs up from our curr---ah nevermind. Codex is more 12 Monkeys anyway.
-Ahh! Leland with the Russ Taylor reveal!
-"What Was Is Lost...But From Death Comes Life!" Slogan last seen on the Codex Company Picnic t-shirts in 2019.
-Spike strip? Riding along with LAPD officers Taylor and Nguyen tonight on COPS, apparently.
-Human lie detector Bozer. Must have picked that up from Cage back in the day.
-Alright, I'm good with that explanation from Taylor. May have been selfish to keep that to himself, but at least it's a sensible explanation.
-Ah man, here we go. This Desi character really is all over-the-place. Wrote themselves into a corner and can't get out.
-Converse All-Stars are really underrated as women's footwear.
-Leland laying out that this isn't all fun and games for Gwen. Here comes the character turn...redemption to inevitably follow.
-This Roman guy is everywhere! Now flying an attack helicopter!
-It wasn't "nuking the fridge" but it worked.
-Riley and Mac are the only two survivors? But that means...Scarlett...NOOOOOOOOOOOO!
-This Roman guy is everywhere! Now helping to transport a nuclear warhead!
-"This can't be what my mom wanted!" Glad the MacGyver character is viewing it that way. Much more palatable.
-I thought everyone knew about the massive volcanic activity under Yellowstone?
-"Nu-cu-lar"...oh, Bozer, no.
-Well, with no Jack, I guess Mac had to sacrifice his own phone this time.
-Riley Davis: 10 Keystrokes or Less...a great slogan for her hacking service.
-Taylor taken out by a good ol' fashioned groin shot. Ouch.
-This Roman guy is everywhere! Now confronting MacGyver at the nuclear device despite the rest of Codex bailing.
-This Roman guy will no longer be everywhere.
-One-way trip? Redemption and the immediate noble sacrifice. A trope as old as screenplay itself. No great parting line like "you taught me well, Major" from the OG's "Humanity," but a nice little bow on that storyline nonetheless.
-Codex severely wounded...but not dead. Lenkov files that folder away. Maybe they'll revisit it. Maybe not.
-Not sure how a busted-up leg prevents Taylor from performing duties like appearing before a Senate Committee.
-Ahh man, here we go, convenient writing rehabbing the Desi/Mac relationship and making it all weirdly cutesey-wutesey again. Remember, she literally at the first drop of a hat distrusted the guy.
-MacGyver using his mother's research for actual good...and how I now think he believes she intended.
And so unexpectedly, but as it turns out, pretty appropriately, Season 4 comes to a close. Was everything perfect, no, but it's hard to argue this wasn't the strongest set of episodes the show has produced. I thought Taylor was a fantastic addition. Riley continues to be great. Matty and Bozer saw their screen time cut, but I think it benefited the show in the long run and made each's scenes more effective. One consistent story arc eliminated the need for much in the way of B-stories, and most importantly, the focus was largely kept on the title character.
That said, where does this show go from here? They have six episodes in the can already for Season 5, but that in and of itself may prevent challenges, especially with another showrunner likely coming aboard. Will they continues with a theme, or will it be more standalone stories? Hopefully no more regular characters are added (maybe even someone will be dropped...couldn't hurt). Finally, if Mac's gonna have a relationship with someone, let's do it right. No more ham-fisted writing. The character and fans deserve better.
Now we wait...could be awhile again, sadly. But at least we know it will be back.
|Posted by: Krug 8 May 2020 - 08:44 PM|
I failed to mention the Desi character in my wrap-up paragraph(s), because I needed to come back around and singularly quote this for posterity.
|Posted by: Dragondog 9 May 2020 - 01:09 AM|
| Just some observations.
Codex is basically PETA for people.
Desi completely turned against Mac, whereas Riley trusted him enough to follow him, Bozer defended him, and Matty turned against Russ to keep Mac safe. Desi and Mac just aren't good as a romantic couple.
Riley got little to no recognition for her hand in saving the world with Mac
So Codex is in hiding? Yeah, i suspect we can add that to the list of plot threads that will forever be unresolved...
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 9 May 2020 - 03:57 AM|
Maybe building a new collective with Mason, Walsh, Kovacs, Amber and all those that got away
Kinda funny that in the pilot, Mac was betrayed by his girlfriend going undercover and now he did the same thing to Desi. Only Nikki disappeared while we might have to listen to Desi accusing Mac of lying to her for the entire season
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 9 May 2020 - 05:22 AM|
| I love the metamorphosis of the creating of this episode.
Written as a season finale (and possibly series finale), filmed as a midseason finale, aired as a season finale
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 9 May 2020 - 11:26 AM|
|Preliminary Ratings: http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/the-sked-friday-network-scorecard-5-8-2020.html|
|Posted by: Zoe2013 9 May 2020 - 01:08 PM|
| well...maybe 6 people in the team are too many, but when I think how easily Roman has cornered Mac twice when Dezi was not around to cover...I don't think we can do without her. That's the main purpose of her presence.
As for romance, sure it looks and sounds awkard, but it's not because they don't have any chemistry...it looks to me they both behave a little bit like real people do when they are not resolved and they are in a relationship bringing their baggage with them...Mac had (has?) abandonment issues, people with abandonment issues tend either to stick to situations too much even when they are over or to disengage too soon, if they really engage to begin with... Bottom line: they always put themselves in a situation not to be hurt by another abandonment. What about the statement "I failed you, you deserved a lot better" - was it episode 3 ?. Why was that? they both seem to agree that is the reason why their relationship "ended" or did not work, so was it because Mac did not put much of himself into it to begin with? did he do anything specific to fail Dezi? Why saying that, if they simply were too different to get along? is there more to it than meets the eye? Will we ever know?
As for Dezi, she may be a badass when it comes to fight, but she showed frailty as a person... she is right when she says that she allowed him in and was hurt when he pushed her away...only he didn't do that on purpose. I think she chose bad timing to ask for confirmation about his feelings (which was by the way the real question she had...but it was safer to ask about which side he would take) because this request came right in the middle of a storm in which he had absolutely no clue what his feelings were, if not simply overwhelming. Wrong tactic. Given the situation he would not do anything different from what he did. She was not on top of his priorities...too much going on in his mind...and given all that happened, would you blame him? Or, let's put it differently: could she rival with what was happening to him?
Now let's hope season 5 will not open 18 months later and we do not get to sit with them and hear what they have to say to each other. MAc has gone through a lot, grew up through it and came out of it with more focus (by the way...I liked the idea that he was the one to reprise his mother's work and be the one who brought her work to the Senate commission like she would have done...and I liked how he started saying his mother...but then started speaking in the first person as if the job is now his to do...) So, it would be interesting to hear what he has to say now, because his approach may be different (having somehow found closure,every piece of the puzzle is now in its place, will that be enough to overcome abandonment issues and start really trusting a significant other?).
As I said, as Taylor as a character is needed to fill Jack's shoes and partially to fill Oversight's shoes, we still need someone to protect him if he still refuses to protect himself, so Dezi is needed as well. It is refreshing that she allows him space to focus on his appearance at the Senate Commission without the need to talk right there right then, let us hope it is not another missed chance to really talk things over.
Overall, I think it was a superb season.
|Posted by: real_ness 10 May 2020 - 04:15 AM|
Well F it......I fell asleep and forgot what I was gonna say to this.....
So how many family members have died now in an explosion self sacrifice style, in just one year on the show? Who's keeping score....
|Posted by: BabyEinstein 10 May 2020 - 09:34 AM|
| First off, Zoe2013 I liked your analysis. Very valid points.
As for me, I loved the episode with a caveat. My comments and what I liked:
1. Mac and Riley working together to figure out it's a nuke. They complement each other so well.
2. Leland: creepy in the way he speaks softly and calmly. He's so dangerous. "Some are worth more than others."
3. Codex: love secret societies. Do we really believe we know all that is happening behind the scenes? Of course they went underground. They must have branches on other continents. No way they could be neutralized with one event.
4. Gwen: love her redemption. She didn't want this in the flashback so she came full circle. Her scene with Leland, those two ate up the screen. Love how she repeated Ellen's words to Mac.
5. Mac lost his father and his aunt (guardian angel) in the same manner. Self-sacrifice, what any parent would do.
6. Desi: I understand that she was hurt so her response was appropriate (tho maybe not before stopping a nuke )
It's just that their relationship has been hard to fathom from the start and she seemed to lose trust in him in 11 & 12. Of course, she exhibited concern for Mac later. After all, you don't turn love on and off like a faucet, and a dangerous situation does bring people closer together.
7. Russ: now we know. His explanation was plausible. I love when he said he couldn't figure Mac out. He's so used to his psy-ops but Mac defies categories.
8. Matty and Bozer, supportive as always.
9. Mac doing Mac stuff--yes! though he did get beat up by Roman pretty badly lol
10. Mac going before the Congressional Committee and doing it his way, with his mom's research, relying on science and reason.
What could have been better:
1. Mac talking to Riley about the Desi situation
2. Mac and Desi talking this out (though they are going to talk later)
3. Resolving all the trust issues in the 'family' . Russ labeled Mac an enemy of the state, after all! I want to know how they got so chummy again.
Now I understand why it ended like that. Too much to cover in 40 minutes. I know the MacRiley shippers are mad, but no way that was going to be explored with so much to do. Leaving it open was the only option.
I can't believe some comments on facebook complaining about the climate change aspect. Need more space for that discussion lol
I read an early interview with Lucas where he said when the 13 episode order came, he figured this was it. So writing and filming kept that in mind. They were almost done when the 9 order came. Guess they wanted it all to end on a friendly note. Mac had his purpose, he's on better terms with Desi, maybe he will grow closer to Riley. But that's for the future.
What I am hoping for:
1. Some lighter episodes and some fun
2. Desi's character developed. I want to like her so please give me positives.
3. Some Bozer/Mac moments, just the bros.
4. Mac's feelings for Riley explored
5. Lots of Mac hacks!
All in all, a great season, Lucas has made Mac his own.
|Posted by: real_ness 10 May 2020 - 06:59 PM|
| Eww I don't MacRiley getting any realer LOL
Some Bozer and Desi backstory would be nice for future episodes.
|Posted by: Shy175223 10 May 2020 - 07:03 PM|
or maybe another
LI for both our Mac and Riley instead of this triangle.. too much drama there would be.
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 10 May 2020 - 11:55 PM|
I think if they want to redeem Desi and get people back to liking her, some backstory is absolutely needed. Not sure if it's not too late, though.
She was introduced as tough and kick-ass military woman last season, but turned into the the clingy, whining girlfriend complaining about everything. It's sheer impossible to empathize with her without knowing anything about her backstory or being able to see how MacDesi started (and especially how/why it failed).
I don't think they will immediately break up, though. At least she won't. Mac lost so much in the last few years and is still grieving. Her breaking it up with him would just make her look more like a heartless jerk.
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 11 May 2020 - 12:52 PM|
|Final Ratings: http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-friday-cable-originals-network-finals-5-8-2020.html|
|Posted by: real_ness 11 May 2020 - 06:52 PM|
I think they forgot about that part...I think they know Vy coming from the type of stories she use to do would be so hungry she would agree to anything and in their arrogance thought anything would fly
Wonder if they did/would, what type of story would they use.....string of jilted lovers, daddy issues....?
I'm also sad Scarlett became cinnamon toast crunch....those two (her and Desi) could have been the iron that sharpens each other. She might have also been a good addition to the Phoenix team (seeing as her crew was ready to sell her out at a discount rate)
|Posted by: BabyEinstein 12 May 2020 - 05:12 AM|
|As for Desi backstory, there's that snippet of her thinking back when Mac asks, what's wrong with ballet. In it, another little dancer tells the child Desi that a particular move is not that hard. Little Desi's response is to punch the girl in the nose. So she has obviously always had anger issues 😂 Dont know which future episode it is part of.|
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 12 May 2020 - 08:46 AM|
I think that might be 4x14, actually... but who knows when that will air... and if. Leave it to CBS to cut out that scene
I think they should have focused on her character development before they got them two together... or at least in the beginning of S4 as they knew they will be back together soon. before everyone started hating on her, at least
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 13 May 2020 - 06:55 AM|
|The episode made it into SpoilerTVs "Quote of the Week": https://www.spoilertv.com/2020/05/quote-of-week-week-of-may-3rd.html|
|Posted by: JD 13 May 2020 - 07:13 AM|
|Although the Phoenix team is too big as it is now, I would make one exception that would be to bring back Scarlett (showing how she survived the helicopter attack) in some limited role. Her "family" outside of Gwen turned on her and she could have some added motivation as a result. As Gwen viewed her as a daughter, it would make her and Mac almost like cousins. I think the dynamic between her and Desi would be fun and entertaining. However, if all the cast returns for a 5th season, there would be too much girl power, imo, and as I said the team is too big as it is now. Nothing against the actress who plays Desi, she does a good job with what is given to her, but I really don't care for her character and while I'd hate to see anyone lose their job, I wouldn't mind if she was written out of the script like Cage and Bozier's former girlfriend (can't remember her character name) was.|
|Posted by: Krug 13 May 2020 - 01:06 PM|
| I mean, I totally agree with it, but I find it funny how much Scarlett has gotten "over," so to speak, than "Season 4 Desi."
Sometimes it just takes a modicum of backstory and character development for attachments to grow.
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 13 May 2020 - 01:28 PM|
it is sorta funny.
I always felt the team is already too crowded, but I certainly wouldn't mind for Scarlett to come back "from the dead" as a recurring. Desi can have some friction with her instead of with Mac
|Posted by: real_ness 13 May 2020 - 08:11 PM|
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 14 May 2020 - 08:22 AM|
|Blog Post by Tech Consultant Rhett Allain: https://rhettallain.com/2020/05/14/macgyver-season-4-episode-13-science-notes-save-the-dam-world/|
|Posted by: real_ness 19 May 2020 - 11:09 PM|
|Thinking back to when Mac got called a Mansplainer.|
|Posted by: Krug 20 May 2020 - 09:42 AM|
It's almost as if a character is gonna be a big part of the title character's life, it might be wise to develop them a bit on-screen...
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 20 May 2020 - 03:41 PM|
| I liked the bookending of the start and end of S4.
screenshot via https://pendragonsandbuckleys.tumblr.com/post/618642843093876736/401-413
|Posted by: Krug 21 May 2020 - 09:12 AM|
|I hadn't picked up on that. Nice writing!|
|Posted by: Dragondog 22 May 2020 - 02:00 AM|
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 22 May 2020 - 04:27 AM|
|the congress will hopefully listen, not like the students sleeping and playing with their phones during class|
|Posted by: MacGyverGod 22 February 2022 - 04:41 AM|
| OK, the season's finale. We proceed on where we were last episode. In general this was a pretty solid episode too. The last 4 episodes were all pretty great episodes despite some flaws here in there. Mostly the strange mood shiftings in episodes like in episode 11. The suspense gets killing and then they release often way too soon and also those weird timings with all the relationship drama talk during a mission. It's not the time nor the place to talk about that.
We've seen the birth of Mac but indeed naming him deliberately after a brand of beef (the most expensive one, I might add) is a bit weird. Then again, how many people out there are actually called Jack Daniels, Williams Lawson or Johnnie Walker? Can any of you imagine being called after a brand of whiskey?
About Codex... I love it when organizations go way back: the Black Plague, the Renaissance, Franz Ferdinand... but it indeed seems a little weird for the Mac family to be involved in such extreme ideologies. Of course this is the reboot and not the original, so things are different but that his mother and aunt would join an organisation that is ready to kill a quarter of the world's population seems so un-Mac-like.
Also the depiction about these organisations or simply environmentalists as evil magnifies the problem that they are actually no better than anyone else despite their good intentions. In the OG show they at least gave options on what you can do yourself to help the environment and I believe that is the only way to save our planet. Do what you can do yourself to help Mother Nature but going after the big companies with guns blazing never ever reached results. If our ecological footprint is too big because of man's desire to travel than why not build more environmental friendly airplanes or ships instead of pointing fingers to those who wishes to see the world and learn about different cultures? There are a lot of things that can be done without restricting ourselves all the time.
I've seen a lot of dying lately but having Aunt Gwen die pretty much the same way as James did... I don't know, maybe I'm overthinking it... maybe it runs in the family or was it lazy writing or didn't they want Mac to have real family left like ours and that he really is now all that is left of the family.
The fact that Scarlett died... I find that hard to believe she didn't survive the attack from the helicopter. Or is she actually dead?
I can understand that but I think Leanna was much more of a blank page and a total unnecessary character.
In my opinion this was pretty much the best season yet. Less focus on the team, less Matty and Bozer and more Mac-oriented than before. Everything had to be so teamy previously.
Even 4 are. Mac, Riley, Russ is more then enough in the field. Matty can coordinate everything from the War Room by herself and have someone like Jill to bring in intel or whatever. And they can really up the ante with Mac's fighting skills.
Everything else you say on Desi is all valid and discussed before. While I still think Desi could be a valuable character, they just did her no justice but that's not a first either in the reboot.
I actually believe that's just the way Tobin Bell speaks in real life. He speaks like that in Saw and 24 as well. Or maybe that's why they offer him these roles.
I think this is a bit of throwback to Kill Zone when Phelps ordered the attack on the forest when he thought Mac was dead. Though he wanted to apologise, Mac said it was not necessary as Phelps just did what he was told. The guy ordered a missile drop to destroy an entire forest with Mac still there! Sometimes it's better to let bygones be bygones. On the other hand Mac and Russ really needed to talk things over.
I don't think Scarlett would settle for a job behind a desk. She'd have to go into competition with Desi. Also nothing wrong with girl power but you may have a point there.
In all a great season despite the very known flaws but the last four episodes were the real standouts. I did miss Murdoc though and before I forget, I really like this new logo they have. This has been a fun ride.
|Posted by: DashboardOnFire 22 February 2022 - 08:19 AM|
| It's kinda funny to read through my old posts and realize how much I predicted right. Mostly the stuff I didn't want to happen
|Posted by: MacGyverGod 23 February 2022 - 02:29 AM|
|Yeah, it's just a pity, I'm always kinda of late to the party but that's what you get for living in Europe, I guess. We're always a year to a year and a half behind with tv-shows.|