Every week I will be posting a new topic titled "Episode Discussion". In this we will discuss an episode, what we liked about it, what we didn't like, etc.


Episode 52 - The Widowmaker

While grieving the lose oh his friend while mountain-climbing, MacGyver is confronted with an old nemesis from the past who wants revenge.

From May 2006

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Good [ 3 ] [11.11%]
Excellent [ 24 ] [88.89%]
Total Votes: 27

Archived Comments

dry.gif It was good scene, an intense scene but my heart absolutely didn't broke for him.

dry.gif

Well in this episode she makes clear that she "cares" for him. Her third episode already of the six.

Maybe not so amusing, maybe because he didn't had anyhing else to lean against. And I don't think he cared.

Ooh, boohoo!!!

They noticed the mines!!! No wonder they go around it.

Yeah, it was alright.

dry.gif Oh, for Gods sakes, please!!!

Yes, I agree with that, Rock. This is one of the scenes that has stayed with me for the last fifteen years (!). It was partly his expression, and partly the way they did the lighting in the scene, I think. But it was so powerful!! As I know I've said before, part of the reason I got so hooked on the show was that they showed Mac as fully human, with the whole range of emotions, and RDA is one of those actors who is *excellent* at conveying deep emotion without saying a word. And I know Pete had a *fantastic* line in this scene, but it's escaping me right now. ARRGH!

Definitely an excellent from me!!

Poor MG! You really do have a problem with this kind of stuff, don't you? happy.gif

I just happen to be a very empathic person - I feel for the pain of others. However, as far as watching TV or movies goes, since I know that it is fiction, it takes a really great acting job in order to make me feel that strongly.

Normally, because I do know that what's happening on the screen is not real, it doesn't affect me emotionally. That's why horror movies don't scare me. In fact during the parts where most people are cringing, hiding their eyes, or screaming, I'm usually laughing. That monster just reached into that guy's chest and ripped out his still-beating heart! Eeeeeewwww! LOL! laugh.gif

However, if I know that a movie is based on actual events, or I'm watching a documentary, that's another story altogether. I have a real problem watching shows like Cops or Emergency, since that's real life and those people are actually experiencing real fear or physical/emotional pain. I've found myself turning the channel when something really disturbing happens. I don't even watch these types of shows anymore.

So, in order for me to really feel that badly for MacGyver means that RDA did a very good job at communicating the pain that MacGyver was in through his acting. Rock was right about the "light behind his eyes."

Good job Rick! clapping.gif

You got to know how to live your self in it. It usually does to me. If it affects you emotionally it's been well done. That's why I like horrorfilms. Take a look at The Fly, or Ju-On The Grudge.

So do I. I felt sorry for Mac too but different. With Mac and with most of the characters I'm a fan of I like to live into the action and adventure and the drama.

That's when I get the kicks. But of course it all depends on the reality.

I do try to, but it isn't often that I get scared by horror movies. I saw The Grude and it didn't do it for me although I enjoyed it. That kid was really creepy!

One time I did get a bit... um... nervous, during a horror movie. I was watching The Blair Witch Project. I don't think that it normally would have been a problem for me but the circumstances were unusual. For one thing, I was at home alone watching it on Halloween night, of all nights! Again, this wouldn't really haven't have been a factor either (I love Halloween!) except for what happened while I was watching the movie.

My couch is right next to a stairwell that has a light in it. The light kept turning on by itself. ohmy.gif I'd get up, turn it off, and go back to watching the movie. But a few minutes later it would turn on again. After about a dozen times of this happening, I finally gave up and left it on.

That got to me! It hasn't happened since then either!

You bet I got creeped out! Going to bed right after the movie was a very tense experience. I haven't cowered under my blankets since I was a kid! laugh.gif

With TV and movies, to really enjoy them, I think that you have to get into the characters. I do that too. If I didn't, I wouldn't have felt so bad for MacGyver. When you are a regular viewer of a TV show you get to know the characters and care about them. Or hate them. Or love to hate them, like Murdoc. It's all part of the TV viewing experience. If you didn't care about (or hate) the characters, then the actors aren't doing their jobs.

MacGyver is a very likable guy.

Not to mention a hottie! laugh.gif wub.gif love.jpg

(Sorry, MG - I just couldn't resist!) clown.gif

Actually it took Murdoc being there and trying to kill them to spring MacGyver back to life. smile.gif Nikki was nice to MacGyver I will give her that.. But I still don't like her. smile.gif

Yes, there is a closing segment in which Mac is shown contructing makeshift climbing gear for he and Nikki.

And during that scene, Nikki says something to him like..."One minute, you can't stand to look down the mountain...and the next minute, you're a mountain goat!"

Great episode!!!

sak.gif

Yep, pretty, kewl... although there is one thing that bugs me about that... and any other scene from any other movie or show where they use morse code.... How is it that there is always someone on the other end who can read morse code?

.-. --- -.-. -.-

Not fair ya know!!! Hmm... when did the second came out? The first one came out approx two months after it was supposed to be. Like six months after it came out elsewhere. Hmm... maybe we're always one set behind? When you get the third we'll probably get the second. I checked the DVD-release list of the store in the town and it's not on it. And the list already goes till 2006. I hope that gets changed.

THAT'S the line I was trying to think of!! Thanks! You would think I'd remember one of my all-time favorite lines... dry.gif And very, very true. Watching this show again, I'm astounded at how much wisdom there is in it... and that's one of the (many) reasons I'm enjoying it as much or more fifteen years later.

But there WAS something wrong with Mike's harness... Murdoc sabotaged it. Don't you remember towards the end, where Mac and Nikki are climbing that same face of the mountain to get away from Murdoc? Mac finds a piece of Mike's harness still anchored in the rock, and finds that it has been partially cut. That's when he put two and two together and figured out what Murdoc was doing there.

As for Mac's "innocence," I guess I never really saw that. Mac always seemed to me to be haunted by all of what he had seen over the years, starting when he was a kid, when his best friend died after being accidentally shot. His parents' deaths, and losing so many friends over the years, seemed to combine sometimes to weigh him down. It wasn't always obvious, as he could be pretty cheerful, and he loved to laugh, but if you look at Mac sometimes in those moments when he thought no one was watching, you can see some sadness around his eyes and mouth. I noticed it almost from the first ep I saw.

You sure thats not a bit of Rick sneeking into Mac?

ohmy.gif THANK YOU for answering a question that has bothered me for a long time! I know, I'm slow headbutt.gif but I actually never put all that together. Duh. *rolls eyes at herself* tongue.gif

Oh I agree that Mac has his share of past hurts and things haunting him, and sometimes you can really see that in him. It's one of those things that makes a character believable and 3D. But I guess it's more the way he deals with them that strikes me as different than Jack. Mac hurts, but he usually doesn't let it drive him completely inward, at least not drastically. It seems to me that he has managed (or perhaps chosen is a better word) to hang onto his trusting nature no matter what. As one kid put it in an episode I can't remember the name of right now "Are you kidding? MacGyver trusts everybody until they go after him with a lead pipe!" (or something like that). biggrin.gif Jack tends to curl back more and stay curled back longer, and he does not trust easily. I guess that was the difference I was trying to pin down. *shrugs* but that's just my opinion. I could be way off. In any event RDA is an awesome actor for the way he does both characters in my opinion. happy.gif

That's one of my all time favorite Mac lines clapping.gif

But there WAS something wrong with Mike's harness... Murdoc sabotaged it. Don't you remember towards the end, where Mac and Nikki are climbing that same face of the mountain to get away from Murdoc? Mac finds a piece of Mike's harness still anchored in the rock, and finds that it has been partially cut. That's when he put two and two together and figured out what Murdoc was doing there.

laugh.gif Convenient, eh?

I don't remember flips either. Hmmmm.

laugh.gif What a coincidence, eh? I've thought that too, but just never put it into words! But this time was more believable--you'll remember, Mac recalls that Ellard knows Morse code. Just happens that he's on the phone when it comes through...


Oh yeah, this one also contains your other pet peeve, Rock! The doors to Nikki's truck lock mysteriously and they can't unlock them! Wonder what it is that keeps that manual knob from being pulled back up? The wonders of TV--you don't have to explain hardly anything. Wait we should be in Nitpickland, shouldn't we...

Look at practically all the times Murdoc shows up--it usually seems too convenient. He's like the king of coincidence--showing up at the right place at a time that just isn't all that great for Mac.

To me it was obvious that he had to have been staking out Mac's place--he knew he hadn't been there in a while--thus his planned message on the mantle and fishing around for some clue as to Mac's whereabouts, listening to the message and finding the brochure. The happy coincidence of Murdoc's timing (with the situation of Mac's despondency) probably added to his glee in exacting his revenge.

laugh.gif Did anything Murdoc do make sense? laugh.gif I do agree with you a bit there, though--some foreshadowing would have added suspense and you'd be wondering "what's he up to now and when's he gonna strike?????" Especially if it was strung out over more than one episode. Although having him just show up out of nowhere is kind of a hallmark Murdoc thing now.

biggrin.gif Fanfics here we come....

Oooooooh, never noticed that before! Have to watch for it next time!

And I agree--the equiment is made for the possibility of a fall. It's possible it failed, but I can't imagine that happening with a master climber, especially one taking a (more than) good friend up who is adverse to heights. She'd have checked it over and over. It would have been great to have something happen other than just failure, like was suggested.

This is sooooo true. I maybe a real geek, but every time when I'm watching this episode, this part moves me to tears (been there, have the friggin' t-shirt dry.gif )
Mac being totally honest and Mike totally crushed. I can relate to it, so to say.

By the way this Mike, is that the same woman as in Jack of lies? They're both Mikes, but I kind of remember they're played by 2 different actresses.
Or I simply should see an optician. biggrin.gif

NO you don't need glasses. It's two different woman. comp26.gif (poor computer.. i don't know who else to take it out on)
They didn't even try to find someone that looked similar to Patricia McPherson. mad.gif

LOL--I just watched Jack of Lies yesterday, too...and you know I was actually kind of impressed that the actress in Widowmaker looks very similar to the original Mike--a bit heavier in the face, but I think they could almost pass for sisters...of course that's not seeing them side by side. Anyway...Still would've been nice to have the original.

I wonder for long time about one point... Everybody noticed there was something wrong with Mike's harness. It seems Murdoc has not sabotagged it...
So: don't you think Mike committed suicide, after Mac rejected her ? I think she was cutting herself her harness when she slept. That's why it is partially cut.
Maybe I am wrong, and I didn't see this ep. recently, but it was my feeling... what about it ?

I really don't think that Mike committed suicide. The equipment failure truely looked accidental. The fact that her harness ripped - OK - She was the expert climber, and Mac was the "student", so she was responsible for checking the equipment and possibly didn't notice the defect. Or maybe the stitches started to loosen during the climb - alot of pressure is generated on that part of the harness during a climb and it might have happened then... I don't think she was the type to lure Mac up the mountain just to throw herself off because he didn't want to take their relationship to the next level. Their conversation started out very harmlessly... just the way friends would joke around with each other... so...

... I don't think she would kill herself because Mac rejected her affection ("...uh oh... she's getting suggestive and he's getting uncomfortable..."). They had been friends for too long. She seemed like a very stable person with alot going for her - not some vapid dingbat. And although she had an emotional moment with Mac ("...All those women in your life and you never learned a thing...") - and I'm sure it wasn't the first, she would not have saboutaged the equipment with the purpose of killing herself.

Yeah, why go to all that trouble? If she was that wacked in the head, she would have just hurled herself off the cliff in the heat of the moment.

This is one of my favorite episodes, and I agree that Mike's death was purely accidental. Someting funny my mom and I noticed was how fast Murdoc works. I mean, Nikki's talking to MacGyver for five minutes at MOST, and during that time he mines a road, rigs a car to explode, gets up to the cabin, and fills it with pictures. Granted, he would have had a little time as Nikki walked up the trail to the cabin, but still... this guy eats jet fuel.

Well, Murdoc sure looks like he drinks the stuff for breakfast. Look at his face, for crying out loud?! A jet fuel cocktail gone wrong? :-) Didn't his mama ever tell him not to guzzle it while the toaster's running?!

He's eatin' something for sure. Look, Mike falls off the same cliff and she's a pancake. Murdoc takes same dive and comes right back in "Cleo Rocks"!

I really like this episode though. :-)

I agree completely. Maybe he's related to a super hero or something...

He sold his soul to the Devil for invincibility or internal life.

*Dies laughing* That's great!

Seriously, though, I thought Mac was really great in this chapter.

Mike didn't deliberately smack her head into the rock, do therefor it must have been an accident. As an expert she should've checked the gear before going up, especially taking someone with you who never did it before.

Mac's emotions in this one were really powerful.

That's it precisely!

If MacGyver is the Patron Saint of Improvisation , then
that would make Murdoc the Demon Angel of Near-Death Experiences!

*Promptly dies with laughter* That's brilliant!

I wonder if Murdoc had gotten too close to the Chernobyl reactor once. You know, strange things happen out there :-) I have my suspicions that even if sufficient voltage were to be applied to Murdoc, he wouldn't react like a normal person would.

Ahyhoo, the guy could really benefit from the application of the lateral cranial impact enhancer.

In spite of this being my favorite Murdoc episode, I can't get over how incredibly bad Mikes death scene was.

The whole premise that an expert climber would race off full of emotion and tears and not take the necessary care required while climbing a high risk mountain is stupid for a start.

But then we move into the bad acting, even worse stunts and what appear to be "out of time and no money left in the budget" effects.

That whole scene is really really bad. Like when Mike gets knocked out from hitting her arm on the ledge.. WHAT??

I guess we are supposed to pretend her head hit the ledge, even though it's quite obviously her arm.

Fortunately the rest of the episode makes up for that whole scene, although I did wonder, when I saw Murdoc stepping over his mine strings in the driveway, why MacGyver and Nikki didn't do the same thing.

It's still a great episode and easily the best Murdoc episode.

Yeah, the little mess-ups are a little distacting, but wow, Nikki and Mac really make up for it. Wow, those two in this episode are dynamite. Nikki is just what Mac need in here.

Ok, Murdoc definitely did NOT sabotage Mike's gear. For one thing, we the viewers would have seen that and Mac would have been getting revenge on Murdoc for taking her life...etc.etc. It would have been a different episode.
But also, Murdoc had no clue Mac was out of town until he went to Mac's house boat. So, no way to that theory.
Mike's character was unbelievable...wish they would have had that conversation during breakfast or something...but then again, he had to feel "more" guilty for her death, so they had to make it right on the mountain.
I don't think an expert climber would make such mistakes.
Also, gear like that does not just fail. Yes, you have to check and recheck your gear, but those harnesses are made to withstand a lot more weight than Mike's, and to think it would snap "just like that" is ridiculous. They should have shown it some other way. And, it would definitely be a lawsuit against whomever manufactured that harness!!
Yes, Murdoc definitely would not have time to rig the stuff he does. LOL That's just TV. Or to die as many times as he does;maybe all of his limbs are titanium?LOL Just kidding.
Either way this is still one of my favorite episodes of all, if not my favorite. You just have to suspend belief for an hour and put up with the crap parts because they had to make it fit into an hour, and work with what they had. Besides, in the 80's, viewers didn't demand as much attention to detail as we do now.
I only wish Pete could have played a larger part in this one; Pete and Jack somehow!
They really needed to make a movie about Mac and Murdoc; or at least a 2 part episode! Instead, what do we get? Holy grail, lost love, and those two last movies? What were they thinking? Where was Murdoc???
And Nikki with Mac was great-I believe she repeated Pete's line because she was grasping at straws, knowing MacGyver was not listening to her. I also think it was good for her to go, because she could be almost rude to him without worrying about harming their "friendship" since they had more of a work relationship instead. When it was Pete, he was too afraid to press the issue.
A good choice, I thought!

Murdoc's a Terminator!

LOL Totally!!! He's really a robot in disguise! LOL

I love all Murdoc episodes---and reading your comments a few things occured to me:
1. I agree about Mike's arm during the death scene.

2. There is another MacGyver fan site that has top ten lists like ten favorite ways for Murdoc to die or ten reasons why he doesn't die. Top ten things Murdoc does for Christmas. You can have fun with pete and Mac. It's the live and learn site.

One the ways they listed for Murdoc to die was from an exploding toilet!!

What do you guys think?

In all seriousness, I love the Widowmaker, but I also wish Mike Forrester's death and her character in the scene was done a little better. It was almost like they wanted you to wonder if Mac and Mike weren't sleeping together, by Mike's reaction.

It's all very bizarre.

it doesn't fit the original character, nor does it make sense as to why she would suddenly appear back in MacGyvers life talking so seriously about her feelings for him, when she didn't say anything about it the last time we saw her.. I don't think there was any mention of her being a rock climber either...

good episode. i don't always get to see an angsty mac. i can understand why he blames himself. when mike was confessing her feelings, i was like "this not the time nor the place to be doing that".

When Mike's roping snapped causing her to fall during the Widowmaker climb. How did the part with the hook come on to the rock face where Nikki and Mac where battleing Murdoc? Just a question.

If I follow the question correctly -- Murdoc chased Mac and Nikki up the same mountain, and they ended up on the same stretch of cliffs where Mike had fallen. Presumably Mike chose that mountain for the initial climb in part because of the convenient proximity to Pete's cabin; and Mac stayed in the area when he was brooding.

During the chase, Mac knew that section of the mountain because he'd recently climbed it; he knew where the hiding places were and how to reach them.

The fall had been recent enough that the remains of Mike's climbing gear were still there, along with her chalk bag.

Thank you for answering my question.

This post has been edited by MacNymph on 23 June 2009 - 04:24 PM

I never really thought about this before, but it's kind of unrealistic. Considering the circumstances-- two people alone on a mountain, and the experienced climber takes an unexpected plunge to her death-- I would think there would be a police investigation to make sure Mac didn't kill Mike, and the climbing gear would have been taken away as evidence to see if Mac tampered with it.

Hmm...you just gave me a possible future fanfic idea. What better way to increase the angst than to have the police suspect him and implicate him? Of course, it might mess up the timeline with Murdoc entering the picture, though...hmm...I'm going to noodle with this for awhile.